Let's Be Honest.

MidnightblueMR2 wrote:

Private chats on fb are not private to Leo's (or courtroom). things you say can be used against you in a form of character assassination. the webserver has to turn everything over at the mildest request. all of your ip's are logged.

~things you learn from your wife...

What do you suggest as an alternative?

tor based website with a server in a non compliant country.

delete everything on this server.

delete anything not sterile on fb and have unspoken rules preventing new entries.

As I mentioned before, if you get into an accident of any kind you could be put in a bad spot. Civil proceedings are not bound by criminal rules(not that Leo's care anyway).

onion routing lol

secret.ly app might be okay too? well unsure where their servers reside

if its on a cell phone its not secure, there are stingrays all over the place these days.

Nothing transmitted across any telecommunications medium is truly secure if you want to have that conversation. If you are just worried about the reach of a US subpoena that's different. Post a meeting spot only. Talk in person.

Go old school Mid Night Club:
"In order to organize a meet up, a Mid Night Team Leader would place an ad in a Tokyo local newspaper, under the "Classifieds" section. Usually it would read of something entirely different than any sort of racing meeting, in order to not draw unwanted attention from law enforcement. The subject of the ad would have been discussed at the previous meet up, so that the team members could look up the ad and specifically meet up at the exact location in order to begin racing, at the exact time. An example of the ad would read something like this:

For Sale: Small handbags at discount prices. For more information, I am available for meetup at Daikoku Parking Area on Thursday, between 11PM and 2AM. Thank you."

I'll jump in on this

So, during the day, I feel that you, and others as well, drive different because in daylight, you feel exposed. Not only that, but you're also aware that with the rising of the sun comes the onset of traffic, police, etc. Basically, the risks associated with the hobby we so much enjoy just increased dramatically.

One thing I've always been happy to see among this group is knowing their own limits. I remember when I met up with Mazeroth and Minnoe, and their cars simply outclassed mine in every way - the feeling of losing sight of your group and wanting to push it harder is difficult to over come.

Once during a larger group outing ( I don't think it was 4touge involved ) we had a guy in a red Civic SI join us, said he did SCCA and was on r-compounds or something and basically was talking like a hot shot. It was his first ever touge run. Had his girl shotgun, cousin in the backseat.

On a DOWNHILL where the group was going at a decent clip, he crossed the double yellow and went to overtake the two cars ahead of him, just before a blind left hand sweeper.



Womp womp.

Anyway, this group has always played it conservatively. If someone is faster than you, they've let them by. Those that have been faster, have never been breathing down the neck of the car in front of them, pushing them to screw up.

I've ran with quite a few different groups of people. I've seen my fair share of screw ups.

Tho, I certainly cannot fault you for being cautious of deer. I nearly was t-boned by one once on Wolf Pen Gap.

I'll jump in on this

So, during the day, I feel that you, and others as well, drive different because in daylight, you feel exposed. Not only that, but you're also aware that with the rising of the sun comes the onset of traffic, police, etc. Basically, the risks associated with the hobby we so much enjoy just increased dramatically.

One thing I've always been happy to see among this group is knowing their own limits. I remember when I met up with Mazeroth and Minnoe, and their cars simply outclassed mine in every way - the feeling of losing sight of your group and wanting to push it harder is difficult to over come.

Once during a larger group outing ( I don't think it was 4touge involved ) we had a guy in a red Civic SI join us, said he did SCCA and was on r-compounds or something and basically was talking like a hot shot. It was his first ever touge run. Had his girl shotgun, cousin in the backseat.

On a DOWNHILL where the group was going at a decent clip, he crossed the double yellow and went to overtake the two cars ahead of him, just before a blind left hand sweeper.



Womp womp.

Anyway, this group has always played it conservatively. If someone is faster than you, they've let them by. Those that have been faster, have never been breathing down the neck of the car in front of them, pushing them to screw up.

I've ran with quite a few different groups of people. I've seen my fair share of screw ups.

Tho, I certainly cannot fault you for being cautious of deer. I nearly was t-boned by one once on Wolf Pen Gap.

I do a lot stupid things, but pushing it with passengers in the car is not one of them. I couldn't even imagine the thought crossing my mind on a road I did not know. That's crazy.

I will also agree with everyone's sentiment, I owe much of my driving acumen to what I have learned on the touge. It has always been a release for me, but I like to make it competitive. That's just how I am.

It was mentioned earlier that driving is a privilege provided by the state. However, it is actually a right affirmed by the Supreme Court as recently as 2001. You can travel on public roads without a license, registration, and insurance, so long as it isn't for commercial gain. Look at your license, it's a commercial license for driving, not traveling. Any state or city law does not supersede this. Trying to explain that to the 5-0 may get you beat and cuffed pretty quickly though.

Sisukas wrote:

It was mentioned earlier that driving is a privilege provided by the state. However, it is actually a right affirmed by the Supreme Court as recently as 2001. You can travel on public roads without a license, registration, and insurance, so long as it isn't for commercial gain. Look at your license, it's a commercial license for driving, not traveling. Any state or city law does not supersede this. Trying to explain that to the 5-0 may get you beat and cuffed pretty quickly though.

That's interesting, just curious do you have a web link to a reputable source to back that up? I'd like to read about that ruling but all the sites I find about it are kinda questionable.

I didn't read everything in here because, quit frankly, that's a lot of reading I'm not very interested in doing at the moment. But I can say most of the mountain roads I've driven on in a spirited manner, I never actually went above the legal speed limit (kind of hard to in some places) but did go above the "recommended" limit. Depends where you do it I guess. GMR had so many technical corners it was hard to get up over the limit before you had to hit the brakes again.

Minnoe07 wrote:

500KEG8 wrote:

If you guys are willing to prove me wrong (not that you need to prove anything to me), or perhaps there is something I'm missing, I'm willing to be shown the "real deal".

Here is the deal. We don't talk about it on here because we don't need to. Why do you ask do we not need to? Because we talk about it in between driving the Touge. I don't need to talk about how I drove better than so and so and how so and so did this or that, because we already talked about it at the Touge. You only see this side of us. The side of us that is coordinating or just bored. This forum is generally inactive other than for planning trips and car builds.

I can honestly say, in all the groups and people I've run with and/or against, this is the most bad a** group of drivers around. Our "normal" is too fast for most people. And our fast is still safe but rediculously fast. And we don't talk about it because we established it on the Touge. No need to bring it back here. Last time I went with a group of Touge "enthusiasts", I was lead and one went into a ditch and the other hit the wall trying to keep up. Just saying.

Save your judgement until you run with us.

Sorry to dig up an older post, and I thank everyone who is commented, I have pondered much of it. While pondering recently, I realized that any claims made on this forum, esp. by people living outside of the geographical location of the core group (in this case GA), is very irrelevant. I suppose my initial desire is to connect with like minded enthusiasts, but I missed something important, the Touge is a very personal thing, and it varies from person to person, from place to place.

You guys will probably never see me, I just don't have time to drive to your neck of the woods. Likewise, I don't recommend wasting your time coming to me, it's just not worth it. I originally posted this out of shear boredom I think, I wanted to see something in you guys that goes beyond what I read in the comments or whatever. I wanted to be entertained because quite frankly 1) I don't get to see what you guys see or experience, and 2) the car scene is Richmond, VA sucks balls! All the same, I still respect you guys, and I have to understand that here I'm just an outsider.

come to tougefest!!!!

Seriously thinking about it.

it will be worth it